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	<title>Comments on: Cameron &amp; Obama</title>
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	<description>This is the Birmingham University Conservative Future</description>
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		<title>By: Joe Gibson</title>
		<link>http://bucf.wordpress.com/2008/07/16/cameron-obama/#comment-9065</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe Gibson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jul 2008 19:40:19 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Perhaps, or perhaps an increase in education, perhaps the Wisconsin model, perhaps reinforcing the meritocracy through numerous incentives for those that do work, or perhaps even just finding people that don&#039;t work a job, after all, we&#039;re always complaining about public services.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps, or perhaps an increase in education, perhaps the Wisconsin model, perhaps reinforcing the meritocracy through numerous incentives for those that do work, or perhaps even just finding people that don&#8217;t work a job, after all, we&#8217;re always complaining about public services.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel</title>
		<link>http://bucf.wordpress.com/2008/07/16/cameron-obama/#comment-9064</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jul 2008 19:34:52 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Perhaps a tightening of claiment rules then?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps a tightening of claiment rules then?</p>
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		<title>By: Joe Gibson</title>
		<link>http://bucf.wordpress.com/2008/07/16/cameron-obama/#comment-9063</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe Gibson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jul 2008 19:31:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucf.wordpress.com/?p=1399#comment-9063</guid>
		<description>We couldn&#039;t have this culture of dependency without the Welfare State, in my view, and so it is of course largely to blame. I made a generalisation as, in the great scheme of things, I am only commenting on an article on a blog, and so my views are largely insignificant (said through gritted teeth!), and so, perhaps (it can be argued) to sensationalise, perhaps (in my opinion) just to sum up my views, I used a generalisation so as to express my views in a short and sweet manner.

My views would probably be much more suited to the American culture where there is a greater emphasis on self-reliance, because I do believe we have a huge culture of dependency, which many sociologists have described as an &#039;underclass&#039;, although i&#039;m not sure I would use this term. Charles Murray argued this underclass to be males as the head of the family discarding the role of breadwinner as they are happy to live off benefits and social security money, although again this might be a bit extreme for me, I certainly do feel some of his idea&#039;s are true.

I am not a Daily Mail reader, although sometimes the way in which I communicate my views might give the impression I am, I do however, believe we have a number of cultures running through this nation that are abhorrent and so need to be changed, and rather regrettably through government intervention as there seems no other alternative. If we, as a nation, continue our present tide of reliance, then I fear we may end up in dire straits and with no way of getting out of it, and even worse, far too content and lazy to do anything about it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We couldn&#8217;t have this culture of dependency without the Welfare State, in my view, and so it is of course largely to blame. I made a generalisation as, in the great scheme of things, I am only commenting on an article on a blog, and so my views are largely insignificant (said through gritted teeth!), and so, perhaps (it can be argued) to sensationalise, perhaps (in my opinion) just to sum up my views, I used a generalisation so as to express my views in a short and sweet manner.</p>
<p>My views would probably be much more suited to the American culture where there is a greater emphasis on self-reliance, because I do believe we have a huge culture of dependency, which many sociologists have described as an &#8216;underclass&#8217;, although i&#8217;m not sure I would use this term. Charles Murray argued this underclass to be males as the head of the family discarding the role of breadwinner as they are happy to live off benefits and social security money, although again this might be a bit extreme for me, I certainly do feel some of his idea&#8217;s are true.</p>
<p>I am not a Daily Mail reader, although sometimes the way in which I communicate my views might give the impression I am, I do however, believe we have a number of cultures running through this nation that are abhorrent and so need to be changed, and rather regrettably through government intervention as there seems no other alternative. If we, as a nation, continue our present tide of reliance, then I fear we may end up in dire straits and with no way of getting out of it, and even worse, far too content and lazy to do anything about it.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel</title>
		<link>http://bucf.wordpress.com/2008/07/16/cameron-obama/#comment-9062</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jul 2008 19:00:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucf.wordpress.com/?p=1399#comment-9062</guid>
		<description>I have some sympathy with limiting benefit payments, although this rather undermines the principle of national insurance. Ypu seem to forget that people are broadly supportive of national insurance and pay it. They then expect the insurance to pay out when they hit difficulties.

However large this culture of dependency you talk about, it is not the fault of the welfare state at all, perhaps only of its mis-management.

Moreover, I&#039;m not entirely sure why you made a generalisation in the knowledge that you were making one. This must mean that on an intellectual level you know you&#039;re discussing the issue in very simplistic terms.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have some sympathy with limiting benefit payments, although this rather undermines the principle of national insurance. Ypu seem to forget that people are broadly supportive of national insurance and pay it. They then expect the insurance to pay out when they hit difficulties.</p>
<p>However large this culture of dependency you talk about, it is not the fault of the welfare state at all, perhaps only of its mis-management.</p>
<p>Moreover, I&#8217;m not entirely sure why you made a generalisation in the knowledge that you were making one. This must mean that on an intellectual level you know you&#8217;re discussing the issue in very simplistic terms.</p>
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		<title>By: Joe Gibson</title>
		<link>http://bucf.wordpress.com/2008/07/16/cameron-obama/#comment-9059</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe Gibson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jul 2008 17:45:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucf.wordpress.com/?p=1399#comment-9059</guid>
		<description>Of course it is a generalistion, that was the point of it, and I believe it to be, at least to a large extent, correct. Rather than blaming Thatcher for every problem our union has suffered in the past 30 years why not look at the greater concepts that influenced her and indeed everyone - the Welfare State was a &#039;nice&#039; idea, help people get back on their feet and all that, however, what Atlee and his government didn&#039;t count on was that their great achievement would be exploited to the extent it has, especially in recent times. This wasn&#039;t their fault, but neither was it Thatchers.

Of course the social security burden rocketed under Thatcher - like it or not, some people can&#039;t compete. Personally I would introduce the Wisconsin Social Benefits model - that you are only allowed to be on benefits if you are able bodied and can work, for five years of your working life. I&#039;m sure this will be considered quite fascist by many of the left, but I believe that this is what our country needs, a good lesson of &#039;pull your finger out of we&#039;ll pull your benefits&#039;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course it is a generalistion, that was the point of it, and I believe it to be, at least to a large extent, correct. Rather than blaming Thatcher for every problem our union has suffered in the past 30 years why not look at the greater concepts that influenced her and indeed everyone &#8211; the Welfare State was a &#8216;nice&#8217; idea, help people get back on their feet and all that, however, what Atlee and his government didn&#8217;t count on was that their great achievement would be exploited to the extent it has, especially in recent times. This wasn&#8217;t their fault, but neither was it Thatchers.</p>
<p>Of course the social security burden rocketed under Thatcher &#8211; like it or not, some people can&#8217;t compete. Personally I would introduce the Wisconsin Social Benefits model &#8211; that you are only allowed to be on benefits if you are able bodied and can work, for five years of your working life. I&#8217;m sure this will be considered quite fascist by many of the left, but I believe that this is what our country needs, a good lesson of &#8216;pull your finger out of we&#8217;ll pull your benefits&#8217;.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel</title>
		<link>http://bucf.wordpress.com/2008/07/16/cameron-obama/#comment-9056</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jul 2008 16:09:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucf.wordpress.com/?p=1399#comment-9056</guid>
		<description>Joe,

Your comment is an historically crass generalisation. Firstly, a culture of dependency will of course exist wherever there is a welfare state or any form of social security regardless of how primitive. Indeed over-dependency is a theme that&#039;s runs through modern British history, probably since the introduction of the poor laws in the 16th century. However, it is not a valid reason for repealing all these social saftey nets. 

If you were more subtle you might suggest a tightening of social provision in order to make it more economically viable for those currently claiming benefits to work. This, however, would be a criticism of specific rules and not the welfare state in general.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Joe,</p>
<p>Your comment is an historically crass generalisation. Firstly, a culture of dependency will of course exist wherever there is a welfare state or any form of social security regardless of how primitive. Indeed over-dependency is a theme that&#8217;s runs through modern British history, probably since the introduction of the poor laws in the 16th century. However, it is not a valid reason for repealing all these social saftey nets. </p>
<p>If you were more subtle you might suggest a tightening of social provision in order to make it more economically viable for those currently claiming benefits to work. This, however, would be a criticism of specific rules and not the welfare state in general.</p>
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		<title>By: Laura Blyth</title>
		<link>http://bucf.wordpress.com/2008/07/16/cameron-obama/#comment-9052</link>
		<dc:creator>Laura Blyth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jul 2008 10:59:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucf.wordpress.com/?p=1399#comment-9052</guid>
		<description>You can tell this blog was written after a nerve of yours had been hit Dan.
I think making parallels between Obama, his policies, and Hitler and Stalin is a bit.. much maybe.

This is coming from a girl who&#039;s still not sure where she stands in McCain vs. Obama race.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You can tell this blog was written after a nerve of yours had been hit Dan.<br />
I think making parallels between Obama, his policies, and Hitler and Stalin is a bit.. much maybe.</p>
<p>This is coming from a girl who&#8217;s still not sure where she stands in McCain vs. Obama race.</p>
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		<title>By: Joe Gibson</title>
		<link>http://bucf.wordpress.com/2008/07/16/cameron-obama/#comment-9048</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe Gibson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jul 2008 23:55:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucf.wordpress.com/?p=1399#comment-9048</guid>
		<description>Although it started with the creation of the Welfare State.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Although it started with the creation of the Welfare State.</p>
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		<title>By: JACK MATTHEW</title>
		<link>http://bucf.wordpress.com/2008/07/16/cameron-obama/#comment-9047</link>
		<dc:creator>JACK MATTHEW</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jul 2008 21:19:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucf.wordpress.com/?p=1399#comment-9047</guid>
		<description>Actually your beloved Mrs T. was the one who allowed dependency to spread. The Social security burden rocketed under her leadership..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually your beloved Mrs T. was the one who allowed dependency to spread. The Social security burden rocketed under her leadership..</p>
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		<title>By: Dan</title>
		<link>http://bucf.wordpress.com/2008/07/16/cameron-obama/#comment-9046</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jul 2008 19:59:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucf.wordpress.com/?p=1399#comment-9046</guid>
		<description>I think you have misunderstood what he is getting at. Your parents clearly helped you because they had pushed themselves to be in a position to help you. Some arent like that. There is growing evidence to suggest that there are those who are poor due to their own bone idleness and desire to have an &#039;easy life&#039;. In many cases its not they cant work but they wont work. 

Labour have created a cluture of dependency and it is being exploited. Cameron is suggesting that those who are poor and wont help themselves will not be subsidised by the state and will have to face up to their actions under the Conservatives, not that all people on lower incomes are all &#039;bone idle&#039; although I can see how it could be interpreted that way.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you have misunderstood what he is getting at. Your parents clearly helped you because they had pushed themselves to be in a position to help you. Some arent like that. There is growing evidence to suggest that there are those who are poor due to their own bone idleness and desire to have an &#8216;easy life&#8217;. In many cases its not they cant work but they wont work. </p>
<p>Labour have created a cluture of dependency and it is being exploited. Cameron is suggesting that those who are poor and wont help themselves will not be subsidised by the state and will have to face up to their actions under the Conservatives, not that all people on lower incomes are all &#8216;bone idle&#8217; although I can see how it could be interpreted that way.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://bucf.wordpress.com/2008/07/16/cameron-obama/#comment-9045</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jul 2008 19:13:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucf.wordpress.com/?p=1399#comment-9045</guid>
		<description>Well as a Labour supporter I&#039;m delighted that Cameron has made that comment about the poor, because it shows how out of touch he is.  My Parents struggle to make ends meet, mainly because they did all they could to get me and my brother through University so we could get a good start in the real world, which we have.  Thanks to that though my Mum and Dad are struggling in many ways.

According to Cameron though, their suffering is all their own fault, despite the fact they were just trying to do their best for their family.

If this is Conservative conviction, insulting people who don&#039;t get everything handed to him on a plate like him and his Eton cronies, I&#039;m moving to an Obama led America.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well as a Labour supporter I&#8217;m delighted that Cameron has made that comment about the poor, because it shows how out of touch he is.  My Parents struggle to make ends meet, mainly because they did all they could to get me and my brother through University so we could get a good start in the real world, which we have.  Thanks to that though my Mum and Dad are struggling in many ways.</p>
<p>According to Cameron though, their suffering is all their own fault, despite the fact they were just trying to do their best for their family.</p>
<p>If this is Conservative conviction, insulting people who don&#8217;t get everything handed to him on a plate like him and his Eton cronies, I&#8217;m moving to an Obama led America.</p>
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